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  1. #1
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    Why is the On3 Performance N54 single turbo kit not popular?

    I rarely see any talk of this kit and it has been available for years.

    Not to many results with it to go by either.

    Apparently On3 keeps updating it though?

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by On3
    Our GT-series turbos doing very well on the N54 single turbo BMW kits
    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge

    They need to share more data than just cars on the dyno:

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    It is popular as a cheap hot parts kit. Turbos are junk but people just replace them.

  3. #3
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    It's crap kit that's why lol. After changing the turbo and wastegate, your price comes to a regular Doc race or ACF/VM top mount kit. You can get speedtech bottom mount kits (very nice IMO) for like $4k with a real turbo and WG, not a chinese knock off.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
    It's crap kit that's why lol. After changing the turbo and wastegate, your price comes to a regular Doc race or ACF/VM top mount kit. You can get speedtech bottom mount kits (very nice IMO) for like $4k with a real turbo and WG, not a chinese knock off.
    That's the explanation I was looking for. Payam to the rescue lol.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    That's the explanation I was looking for. Payam to the rescue lol.
    Anytime Click here to enlarge
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    A local BMW shop owner, who has installed multiple single turbos on n54s, said the on3 was the worst fitting of all of them when I was at his shop talking shop.

    The Turbo is junk as @Payam said after you replace the turbo you might as well bought a proper fitting kit with better design shorter runners etc. Acf beats DocRace imo given they cost basically the same for a top mount.

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    Somewhat amusing that after this thread they put up they are looking for an N55 or B58 to develop a top mount with:

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by On3 Performance
    We are looking for a customer willing to allow us to work with their N55 or B58 platform BMW over the winter to develop our new top mount systems. If interested please let us know
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    ON3 Popular with mustangs especially coyote motors....

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Blown6 Click here to enlarge
    ON3 Popular with mustangs especially coyote motors....
    That is true and I can't understand why there doesn't seem to be the same "their turbos are junk" claim on the Mustang side. I think the Coyote kit costs a bit more, and the cars are still a bit more expensive, so people are more apt to spend proper money on install.

    The 335i market has become akin to the B-series turbo swap honda boys that try and do everything for a dime, which means a typical lack of knowledge in some areas, which can lead to poor installations, and ultimately failure.

    Don't get me wrong, the On3 turbo that ships with the kit is very small as well if I recall, and suitable for about 500whp peak. Once you push it too far it just goes south. Twin GT35s on a Coyote will get close to, if not over 1000 whp, so they are stressed a bit less.

    To revert back to something @Torgus said - why is the ACF kit not as prevalent as the Doc kit if they are priced similarly? Is it purely a marketing thing and Doc has the market cornered there?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by langsbr Click here to enlarge
    The 335i market has become akin to the B-series turbo swap honda boys that try and do everything for a dime, which means a typical lack of knowledge in some areas, which can lead to poor installations, and ultimately failure.
    Amen. And it keeps getting cheaper somehow...
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by langsbr Click here to enlarge
    why is the ACF kit not as prevalent as the Doc kit if they are priced similarly? Is it purely a marketing thing and Doc has the market cornered there?
    This is just my opinion... ACF sucks at marketing and doesn't seem to care as they have plenty of fabricating business as their stuff is damn good. @Payam@BMS can probably concur.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by langsbr Click here to enlarge
    That is true and I can't understand why there doesn't seem to be the same "their turbos are junk" claim on the Mustang side. I think the Coyote kit costs a bit more, and the cars are still a bit more expensive, so people are more apt to spend proper money on install.

    The 335i market has become akin to the B-series turbo swap honda boys that try and do everything for a dime, which means a typical lack of knowledge in some areas, which can lead to poor installations, and ultimately failure.

    Don't get me wrong, the On3 turbo that ships with the kit is very small as well if I recall, and suitable for about 500whp peak. Once you push it too far it just goes south. Twin GT35s on a Coyote will get close to, if not over 1000 whp, so they are stressed a bit less.

    To revert back to something @Torgus said - why is the ACF kit not as prevalent as the Doc kit if they are priced similarly? Is it purely a marketing thing and Doc has the market cornered there?
    There have been numerous revisions over the years to get the mustang kit to where it is now. Although the supercharger kits, which are easier to install and do not alter exhaust sound, are closing the gap on hp at decent price points.

  13. #13
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    This is just my opinion... ACF sucks at marketing and doesn't seem to care as they have plenty of fabricating business as their stuff is damn good. @Payam@BMS can probably concur.
    ACF/VM kit died down after I parted ways and joined BMS. There are about 150 of them in circulation over the years from my 2014 release. Doc Race has been known in the industry, so just by having a brand name is better by default.

    ACF/VM kit IMO is a much better and well designed top mount vs the Doc kit.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by langsbr Click here to enlarge
    To revert back to something @Torgus said - why is the ACF kit not as prevalent as the Doc kit if they are priced similarly? Is it purely a marketing thing and Doc has the market cornered there?
    I think DR has the name and all the 'youtubers' bought doc race kits. So people buy what they see or hear about aka marketing.

    The ACF kit is superior and basically the same price. Anthony still sells them AFAIK. Zero advertising.

    As sticky said ACF does not seem to care a great deal as they are very busy with the fabricating side of the business it seems.

  15. #15
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
    As sticky said ACF does not seem to care a great deal as they are very busy with the fabricating side of the business it seems.
    Yep, I would say 70% is BMS stuff. The rest of the stuff is private label for huge companies in Aerospace (Nasa/Boeing) as well as some stuff for Saleen, Doc Race, Aviva, etc.
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  16. #16
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
    ACF/VM kit IMO is a much better and well designed top mount vs the Doc kit.
    What is your reasoning for this?
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    What is your reasoning for this?
    Runners are shorter and more direct, much better collectors that keep velocity up to increase spool and transient response. Better WG placement, so there are no chances for boost creep. Comes with a 3.5" Downpipe vs their 3". Stainless steel wastegate/vacuum lines to -4AN fittings as well as provided mac solenoid, they don't provide anything. Same kit fits both RWD and AWD, doesn't need to be kit specific. Has the option for recirculated wastegates... That's what I can think of from the top of my head.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Runners are shorter and more direct, much better collectors that keep velocity up to increase spool and transient response. Better WG placement, so there are no chances for boost creep. Comes with a 3.5" Downpipe vs their 3". Stainless steel wastegate/vacuum lines to -4AN fittings as well as provided mac solenoid, they don't provide anything. Same kit fits both RWD and AWD, doesn't need to be kit specific. Has the option for recirculated wastegates... That's what I can think of from the top of my head.
    Reading this makes me think Doc Race is overrated but better branded.
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    Payam,

    Thank you for the explanation. I am going to look into this top mount kit a bit more now! I never cared for the hype train on the docrace top mounts. Though they do look nice!



    I looked at a thread with the kit installed. The fitment seems a bit off?? Can you confirm if all these little fitment issues were resolved?

  20. #20
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jeff15 Click here to enlarge
    Payam,

    Thank you for the explanation. I am going to look into this top mount kit a bit more now! I never cared for the hype train on the docrace top mounts. Though they do look nice!

    I looked at a thread with the kit installed. The fitment seems a bit off?? Can you confirm if all these little fitment issues were resolved?
    @Payam@BMS
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  21. #21
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jeff15 Click here to enlarge
    Payam,

    Thank you for the explanation. I am going to look into this top mount kit a bit more now! I never cared for the hype train on the docrace top mounts. Though they do look nice!

    I looked at a thread with the kit installed. The fitment seems a bit off?? Can you confirm if all these little fitment issues were resolved?
    As long as you chose a PTE frame size or similar turbo, you won't have any fitment issues.

    The fitment issues came mostly when people tried putting in custom turbos he doesn't offer for them.

    Lifetime warranty and he stands by his products. I think he has one ready to ship in stock with a 6266.
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  22. #22
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Runners are shorter and more direct, much better collectors that keep velocity up to increase spool and transient response. Better WG placement, so there are no chances for boost creep. Comes with a 3.5" Downpipe vs their 3". Stainless steel wastegate/vacuum lines to -4AN fittings as well as provided mac solenoid, they don't provide anything. Same kit fits both RWD and AWD, doesn't need to be kit specific. Has the option for recirculated wastegates... That's what I can think of from the top of my head.
    Yup, literally every detail is better on the ACF vs DR. Given they are the same price I can only think DR get's the business because of advertising/marketing/you tube. Anyone who does literally the smallest ammount of research can see which kit is superior.

    I almost went with DR until I talked with Anthony@ACF.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Payam@BMS Click here to enlarge
    As long as you chose a PTE frame size or similar turbo, you won't have any fitment issues.

    The fitment issues came mostly when people tried putting in custom turbos he doesn't offer for them.

    Lifetime warranty and he stands by his products. I think he has one ready to ship in stock with a 6266.
    It's fair to point out that while ACF does awesome work the support and communication aren't great. For a long time you were basically their sales team online.

  24. #24
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky2 Click here to enlarge
    It's fair to point out that while ACF does awesome work the support and communication aren't great. For a long time you were basically their sales team online.
    Unfortunate yet true.
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