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  1. #1
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    Wedge Log vs V8Bait Log

    Since nobody wants to post a log of Wedge's flash showing all 6 cylinders I decided to show the results.

    Car is running FBO+100%Meth+94 Oct.

    I asked Wedge for a Pump/Meth map and he sent me a map stating 12.5* of timing. I figured it's aggressive but safe based on my mods. I logged it and it looked great, BEFORE 6cylinder logging was available.

    Tested it out again and the results were not impressive. First off, it clearly shows the map is targeting close to 14* of timing which is way too much for 94/Meth. It's safe to say you need E85/Meth/FBO to run this type of tune.

    http://www.datazap.me/u/triggz/wedge...25-26-27-28-29

    Now here is the tune I run on a day to day basis which is much smoother while cruising and the car responds well post shift.

    http://www.datazap.me/u/triggz/v8bai...25-26-27-28-29



    I'm sure if I dropped the additive to 50 from 60, the logs would be even cleaner or adjust auto shift boost reduction.

    Going for a dyno session this saturday and I will test Wedge's map with a 50 additive, 55 additive and 60 additive along with V8Bait's map 50/55/60 and see if the added timing really produces the results that everyone's butt dyno claims to be feeling.

    Just be careful what you guys are running out there. You can't just load a tune without logging. I'm sure Wedge's map could be adjusted so that it looks cleaner but he's so busy that I rather not waste my time.

    FYI, I NEVER had an ugly log with BMS maps. I personally think they are the safest and most reliable Bimmerboost maps you can use for your car.

  2. #2
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    Remember when everyone used to argue that 2-6 cylinder logging wasn't needed, and seeing #1 was giving you the whole story? Funny how everyone forgets that now that 6 Cyl logging is available for the JB...Click here to enlarge

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    I want 6 cyl on my Procede :.(
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Remember when everyone used to argue that 2-6 cylinder logging wasn't needed, and seeing #1 was giving you the whole story? Funny how everyone forgets that now that 6 Cyl logging is available for the JB...Click here to enlarge
    Lol, my argument was always that we already knew what curves were best/safest for the engine from the cobb guys (like myself for a stint), so transplanting those timing targets to jb4 cars always gave similar results with better boost control and more safety features. Cylinder 1 logging wasn't the whole story but was sufficient to me in evaluating problems and when used for failsafes. Testing for limits on one cylinder on a dyno, it's impossible to know if you found mbt or just hit a level where timing is getting removed you can't see, but at that point it's at the peak anyway and a few corrections (seen or unseen) always seemed relatively safe to me, I dunno. But having all 6 now really is incredible, I don't feel inclined to pull the Cobb out of my sisters car to test things I want the jb4 to do first anymore lol.

    For novel applications like your setup Tony 6 cylinder logging was necessary info to have if you wanted to push it, which you did, I think you and D were right on with that. Cobb worked out well for you guys, tons of work and new tricks later but it pushed things forward on their end as well. I'll admit I didn't think cobb could even handle such a custom setup looking for as much boost as you needed, but it seems like they've really came through. The hard road, though.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I want 6 cyl on my Procede :.(
    Technically I still believe Shiv had the ability to make it happen before Terry, by almost a year I bet. But we're talking about shiv here. Smart dude, but I wish you and your OFT tablet brethren good luck with lighting that fire haha.

    I think the moral here is to anybody running aggressive tunes (even the BMS ones) you should take some time to log now that this is available to us, you might be surprised. Thanks for the kind words triggz, this also highlights the importance of learning to self tune or having somebody help you dial the car in. OTS maps have lots of assumptions.

  5. #5
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I want 6 cyl on my Procede :.(
    +1, but we all know that's never going to happen Click here to enlarge
    Stuff

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    We've known MBT values for years but still glad the new feature is being put to good use!
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Remember when everyone used to argue that 2-6 cylinder logging wasn't needed, and seeing #1 was giving you the whole story? Funny how everyone forgets that now that 6 Cyl logging is available for the JB...Click here to enlarge
    Stirring sh!t as always.

    How about those stage 3's. Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dirty Dog Click here to enlarge
    Stirring sh!t as always.

    How about those stage 3's. Click here to enlarge
    They are doing great actually, thanks for asking. Not stirring anything, just stating a fact, I could easily go back and find many post where people were literally arguing that you did not need to see 2-6 #1 was telling you all you needed to know. Even when logs were posted with #1 dead quiet and #5 pulling 10.5 degrees. I am honestly stoked to see all 6 being all to log now on the piggys as its a much needed feature, but its just so quick people forget that it was touted as not something that was important just a couple months ago.

    How about any of your projects, oh you mean you have never built anything custom Click here to enlargeClick here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

  9. #9
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    They are doing great actually, thanks for asking. Not stirring anything, just stating a fact, I could easily go back and find many post where people were literally arguing that you did not need to see 2-6 #1 was telling you all you needed to know. Even when logs were posted with #1 dead quiet and #5 pulling 10.5 degrees. I am honestly stoked to see all 6 being all to log now on the piggys as its a much needed feature, but its just so quick people forget that it was touted as not something that was important just a couple months ago.

    How about any of your projects, oh you mean you have never built anything custom Click here to enlargeClick here to enlargeClick here to enlarge
    All you're doing is indirectly bad mouthing a tuner's tune that supports the majority on this platform. Not a wise move my friend. Let's not forget your still relatively new here. I think it's time you hire someone to manage your online gigs cause your online persona is nothing but ignominious and I'm sure many would agree. Click here to enlarge

    I've constructed many custom builds in the past however I choose to actually do the work rather than just talk. Click here to enlarge

    Sorry for the thread jack OP.

  10. #10
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dirty Dog Click here to enlarge
    All you're doing is indirectly bad mouthing a tuner's tune that supports the majority on this platform. Not a wise move my friend. Let's not forget your still relatively new here. I think it's time you hire someone to manage your online gigs cause your online persona is nothing but ignominious and I'm sure many would agree. Click here to enlarge

    I've constructed many custom builds in the past however I choose to actually do the work rather than just talk. Click here to enlarge

    Sorry for the thread jack OP.
    he didnt really bad mouth any tune or any one, but poked a finger at those who said all you needed was cyl 1. In OPs post its clear the maps BMS offered for his products worked very well. And Terry has this to a science its more at the wedge guys saying wow my car is so fast look its a good log while smarter people knew what they were doing was pushing things way too far with the tools at hand.

    OP great thread, thanks
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  11. #11
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    This type of data is very valuable and we definitely need more of it for people to properly evaluate choices. I'm surprised how many people are willing to blindly use maps they do not really know too much about to save a $.

    Repped OP.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ChuckD05 Click here to enlarge
    he didnt really bad mouth any tune or any one, but poked a finger at those who said all you needed was cyl 1. In OPs post its clear the maps BMS offered for his products worked very well. And Terry has this to a science its more at the wedge guys saying wow my car is so fast look its a good log while smarter people knew what they were doing was pushing things way too far with the tools at hand.

    OP great thread, thanks
    Agreed but that finger poking has it's hidden agenda. Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dirty Dog Click here to enlarge
    Agreed but that finger poking has it's hidden agenda. Click here to enlarge
    It does? Please tell me me what it is, as I would like to know. I honestly know nothing of the Wedge tunes, all I know is Ken was great when we needed help. If some people are happy with it, then thats great. People have preferences and its good there is options.

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    I kinda agree with Tony, it's very important information that was touted as meh. To me it was meh, to Terry it was meh, but to people running 15 degrees on pump who have never even looked at a log or used a cobb and looked at a log, it's likely to be not meh.

    I'll go ahead and say with the developments of late, it was more important to the community than I thought it was. I mean some people really don't understand this stuff at all, and it's easy to forget.

  15. #15
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by V8Bait Click here to enlarge
    I kinda agree with Tony, it's very important information that was touted as meh. To me it was meh, to Terry it was meh, but to people running 15 degrees on pump who have never even looked at a log or used a cobb and looked at a log, it's likely to be not meh.

    I'll go ahead and say with the developments of late, it was more important to the community than I thought it was. I mean some people really don't understand this stuff at all, and it's easy to forget.
    In my opinion, the more you know about the engine you are tuning the better. If you are watching #1 and its dead quiet and you think you are good, and #5 is pulling 10 degrees, that really isn't meh. True if you have a solid understanding of what is going on, you are safer for it, but the more information the better. Always

  16. #16
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by V8Bait Click here to enlarge
    I kinda agree with Tony, it's very important information that was touted as meh. To me it was meh, to Terry it was meh, but to people running 15 degrees on pump who have never even looked at a log or used a cobb and looked at a log, it's likely to be not meh.

    I'll go ahead and say with the developments of late, it was more important to the community than I thought it was. I mean some people really don't understand this stuff at all, and it's easy to forget.
    The addition of 2-6 cylinders is great, don't get me wrong. It's allowed me to alter my tune a little. I've been playing with ATR since it's release with both of my N54's. I do my own backend flashes as well as for some other guys too but was quite content with viewing cylinder 1. I don't run 15 degrees of timing on my E50-E60 plus meth setup but I think the main issue is that there is too many guys out there that don't know what they are doing and think the timing (Main) table is their best friend and jump in and crank it up without any idea or run someone else's flash and think "well it worked on that car so it should do the same on mine". I don't doubt Wedge's flashes but one must go in carefully and log the crap out of it. Not ideal, but hey.

  17. #17
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    In my opinion, the more you know about the engine you are tuning the better. If you are watching #1 and its dead quiet and you think you are good, and #5 is pulling 10 degrees, that really isn't meh. True if you have a solid understanding of what is going on, you are safer for it, but the more information the better. Always
    really? you want more info on how s65>all ? Click here to enlarge
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    I think anyone that has information or a tool available to them but chooses not to use it or continues to use a method despite what that information tells them seriously needs to re-evaluate what they're doing.
    Click here to enlarge
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    I think anyone that has information or a tool available to them but chooses not to use it or continues to use a method despite what that information tells them seriously needs to re-evaluate what they're doing.
    nicely put have to agree 100%

  20. #20
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    I think anyone that has information or a tool available to them but chooses not to use it or continues to use a method despite what that information tells them seriously needs to re-evaluate what they're doing.
    Same page as always my man...Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Same page as always my man...Click here to enlarge
    we're just haters lol
    Click here to enlarge
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    I think anyone that has information or a tool available to them but chooses not to use it or continues to use a method despite what that information tells them seriously needs to re-evaluate what they're doing.
    Torpedos of truth from Allen...once again Click here to enlarge

    It astounds me the degree to which some people will just toss on the most aggressive mapping they can find, with no real regard for ANYTHING tuning or hardware related. That has nothing to do with any one tuner over the other, I mean broadly speaking. It's cray.
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  23. #23
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    Good discussion here, I just know the Cobb guys are smiling at the "told you so" realizations that are going to be trickling in over the next few months from the uninitiated. Maybe it's time both camps raise a glass to good logs before complaints over LTFT and MAF request/actual logging start popping up Click here to enlarge

    Kidding that would be completely juvenile and cobb users are much more discerning than that I'm sure, that's why they hang out here and not e90 amirite?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Torpedos of truth from Allen...once again Click here to enlarge

    It astounds me the degree to which some people will just toss on the most aggressive mapping they can find, with no real regard for ANYTHING tuning or hardware related. That has nothing to do with any one tuner over the other, I mean broadly speaking. It's cray.
    I agree with you that it is the end user choice to use the tune or not. However, these people looks up to the tuner for advice and helps. It not right to send out 13-15 degree flash when the tuner knows that the end user doesn't have supporting mods or fuel to run it. When things went wrong it always not the tune false. It always "it's the car false not the flash".

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Dirty Dog Click here to enlarge
    Stirring sh!t as always.

    How about those stage 3's. Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    They are doing great actually, thanks for asking. Not stirring anything, just stating a fact...
    Stating a fact with clear intent to stir $#@!. How long since you took peoples money for those stage 3's? How long till you deliver. How many more excuses and $#@! stirring in the meantime?

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