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  1. #1
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    BB flash - map test

    Hey guys,

    The BB development crew is finally getting the bugs worked out on the free MSD81 flashing program. So I decide to upload the open source "procede flash" map for a test just to see how it jives with the JB4. I'm running my normal setup of map 7, E40, meth. I'll have to study it a bit more but here are my initial comments:

    1) I really dislike the huge boost target down low. The JB4 is programmed to take the higher of its internal target or the DME target. So our otherwise smooth maps become hairpin trigger boost bombs with this flash map as is.
    2) The AFR targets are too rich up top for my taste. It may be OK for meth but trying to support this target on E85 alone IMHO is not going to be practical.
    3) The huge load taper at higher RPM is triggering the JB4 to slightly close the throttle on the shift. I don't know if this is by map design or just a byproduct of something we do differently between the JB4 and the procede. On the JB4 back end flash maps we run a more consistent factory boost curve to avoid this behavior.
    4) The main thing I wanted to see was post shift timing. It started out promising but sort of deteriorated after a couple of runs. AT timing post shift has basically governed how we do our JB4 back end flash so I was really hoping that there was some magic bullet here that Cobb had overlooked in their mapping. But so far I don't have enough data yet to say its any better than the normal Cobb maps/tables in this regard. The BMS flash maps of course are setup entirely differently so I'll have to port those over to TunerPro for some addl testing on that front.
    5) Flash write time was 14min. Not bad at all. Someone just posted code that cuts that to 2min so I'll test it shortly.
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    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mr. Boost Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    +1
    2010 e92 M3 Jet Black | DCT | ESS Tuned | Akrapovic Slip-on | Challenge X-pipe | AFE Intake | 18" Volk TE37SL | KW V3 Coilovers | RPI Scoops | Under Drive Pulley

    2007 e92 Mont. Blue 335i | 6MT | COBB Tuned | Quaife 3.46 LSD | Helix FMIC | AA DPs | HKS Exhaust | DCI | Stett CP w/ Forged DVs | KWv2 Coilovers | UUC Sway Bars & SSK | HPF Stg 2 Clutch | HFS-4 | M3 Suspension Bits | DEFIVfab Diff Lockdown Kit | Stoptech Trophy BBK

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    is this his OTS standalone map or his stacker map?

  5. #5
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    This is the stacker map. I've had 3-4 guys ask me if they can use it with the JB4 so I told them I'd do some testing for them.
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    lol looks like your pump gas backend flash timing curve. advance 6 degrees of timing thru CPS for E85 mixes? lol

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    lol looks like your pump gas backend flash timing curve. advance 6 degrees of timing thru CPS for E85 mixes? lol
    That is a good point. He has also dialed in less advance post shift so I'll have to crank that up to where I'd want it to better evaluate the timing flatline. Shiv claimed that TunerPro was like ATP on steroids but so far I have not found a way to do something simple like make a "favorite tables" area so I don't need to keep scrolling through irrelevant tables to find the ones I want. Major over hype. TP is free software though so I can't complain but lets get real here. It is no ATP.
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    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    That is a good point. He has also dialed in less advance post shift so I'll have to crank that up to where I'd want it to better evaluate the timing flatline. Shiv claimed that TunerPro was like ATP on steroids but so far I have not found a way to do something simple like make a "favorite tables" area so I don't need to keep scrolling through irrelevant tables to find the ones I want. Major over hype. TP is free software though so I can't complain but lets get real here. It is no ATP.

    wtf? I know my eyes arent deceiving me ... 5.5 degrees at 5500 rpm but 9.5 degrees at 6000? please tell me Shiv isnt that careless??

    edit: looking at the curve ramp up on your logs he may very well be that careless :\

  9. #9
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    wtf? I know my eyes arent deceiving me ... 5.5 degrees at 5500 rpm but 9.5 degrees at 6000? please tell me Shiv isnt that careless??

    edit: looking at the curve ramp up on your logs he may very well be that careless :\
    That is how he's mapped it. Shrug.
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    lol you need to port your backend flash using TP ASAP. hell maybe even the procede stackers can reap some benefits. Click here to enlarge

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    lol I'll work on it. I need to learn how to use TP first. I'm not sure how to make the "patch" files that go in and make my changes for others. I'll try to read up on it this week. As usual buried with day to day stuff today. Click here to enlarge

    I'm not sure what the ETA is for the BB flash release but I think in the near future they'll be looking for brave members to help test it out. If you have a BT cable handy maybe you can volunteer yourself. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    lol I'll work on it. I need to learn how to use TP first. I'm not sure how to make the "patch" files that go in and make my changes for others. I'll try to read up on it this week. As usual buried with day to day stuff today. Click here to enlarge

    I'm not sure what the ETA is for the BB flash release but I think in the near future they'll be looking for brave members to help test it out. If you have a BT cable handy maybe you can volunteer yourself. Click here to enlarge

    no BT cable, only a DCAN cable. Click here to enlarge

    im in no rush to dump the AP yet anyway.

  13. #13
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    I have a feeling now that you can load the maps for free Shiv is not going to be so generous to post XDF files for the rest of the DME versions or add the 3D fuel scalar. So some real open source tuners are going to need to step in and help out there. I'm a programmer and a tuner but digging through factory BINs looking for tables is not really my thing. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    I have a feeling now that you can load the maps for free Shiv is not going to be so generous to post XDF files for the rest of the DME versions or add the 3D fuel scalar. So some real open source tuners are going to need to step in and help out there. I'm a programmer and a tuner but digging through factory BINs looking for tables is not really my thing. Click here to enlarge

    openflash isnt so open anymore now is it? lol, we will see.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    I have a feeling now that you can load the maps for free Shiv is not going to be so generous to post XDF files for the rest of the DME versions or add the 3D fuel scalar. So some real open source tuners are going to need to step in and help out there. I'm a programmer and a tuner but digging through factory BINs looking for tables is not really my thing. Click here to enlarge
    3D fueling should be covered by someone asap. Anyone?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    openflash isnt so open anymore now is it? lol, we will see.
    I really hope our N54 tuning world does not turn into closed again...

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    I have a feeling now that you can load the maps for free Shiv is not going to be so generous to post XDF files for the rest of the DME versions or add the 3D fuel scalar. So some real open source tuners are going to need to step in and help out there. I'm a programmer and a tuner but digging through factory BINs looking for tables is not really my thing. Click here to enlarge
    also arent you technically a tablet owner? im sure you should be able to get whatever they got.

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    Hehe I bought a few to play with but not from Shiv. PG3 will sell them to anyone for $200. Just toys for my personal collection. A few years ago I dropped 12k+ on a Genius flash utility. Now you can do the same thing for $200. Or free. Amazing how that works. Click here to enlarge
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Hehe I bought a few to play with but not from Shiv. PG3 will sell them to anyone for $200. Just toys for my personal collection. A few years ago I dropped 12k+ on a Genius flash utility. Now you can do the same thing for $200. Or free. Amazing how that works. Click here to enlarge

    got it, shivs profit per unit is $195. Click here to enlarge who knows how much rombinhood gets.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Hehe I bought a few to play with but not from Shiv. PG3 will sell them to anyone for $200. Just toys for my personal collection. A few years ago I dropped 12k+ on a Genius flash utility. Now you can do the same thing for $200. Or free. Amazing how that works. Click here to enlarge
    $12k ._.
    2010 e92 M3 Jet Black | DCT | ESS Tuned | Akrapovic Slip-on | Challenge X-pipe | AFE Intake | 18" Volk TE37SL | KW V3 Coilovers | RPI Scoops | Under Drive Pulley

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
    $12k ._.
    you can feed 10500 people mcchickens after taxes Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    you can feed 10500 people mcchickens after taxes Click here to enlarge
    Yeah, in retrospect it was a waste. But, no sense crying over money spent. I've got probably $100k in spare connectors and components floating around for products we never released or are yet to release. It happens.

    On the tablet profit, my best guess is Shiv is paying around $250 to allow sufficient profit for ROM. I think the real loser in this is Adrian @ Vishnu who I suspect is paid as a function of procede sales. Since shiv is throwing his weight behind the tablet now he's essentially thrown Adrian under the bus.
    Last edited by Terry@BMS; 07-29-2013 at 05:31 PM.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    lol I'll work on it. I need to learn how to use TP first. I'm not sure how to make the "patch" files that go in and make my changes for others. I'll try to read up on it this week. As usual buried with day to day stuff today. Click here to enlarge

    I'm not sure what the ETA is for the BB flash release but I think in the near future they'll be looking for brave members to help test it out. If you have a BT cable handy maybe you can volunteer yourself. Click here to enlarge
    Just got my free BT cable today, LMK if you guys need a tester for MSD80
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Since shiv is throwing his weight behind the tablet now he's essentially thrown Adrian under the bus.
    That's pretty much standard operating procedure.

    Adrian has talent so why doesn't he just do his own thing? I don't get it. Why should his name be sullied by association?

    Regardless, that's a heft profit margin about what I figured. So you can give Shiv and company an extra $200+ or keep it in your own pocket instead of his while being able to use more devices/cables. Should this even be a discussion?

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    I find it very funny that the first logs I have seen from the tablet are from terry. Like you said I am sure shiv wont be open with the maps much longer.

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