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  1. #1
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    5 out of 5 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No

    VT2-500 - Euro Headers/Cats vs SS V1 Stepped / HJS Cats

    Euro headers/cats dyno was on September 13th, 2012: 440 rwhp, 304 lb/ft tq SAE.
    SS V1 stepped / HJS cats dyno was on December 4th, 2012: 464 rwhp, 314 lb/ft tq SAE.

    Same dyno, same dyno operator, same gear (4th), same tune, same fuel (91 U.S. piss with the highly coveted 10% ethanol mix).
    A nice difference from the improved VE with the Supersprint setup!
    Sending the info to Sal to maybe richen it up a bit in the upper RPM range.
    So far (600 miles with the V1/HJS), no codes, no CEL.
    Car runs perfectly; a treat to drive every time.

    Downstream from the headers/cats is Supersprint X-pipe with resonator, and the SS Street muffler.
    Upstream is a K&N RU-3130 air filter attached to a silicone hose with a 30 degree angle at the end.
    This makes for an excellent fit over the top of a stock brake duct and in front of the wheel well cover.
    No part of the filter is directly exposed to the elements, or blocking any airflow through the brake duct.

    Big thanks to Alex (flipm3) for putting together the graph layout below.
    I'll eventually get there, but wanted to post this sometime before the next century.

    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    2006 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Carbon Black Metallic | Cinnamon | No Sunroof | OE CSL Bootlid | 3.91 Diff | TCK | DrVanos | Volk
    StopTech ST-40 | Supersprint V1 Stepped | Bimmerworld C&R | BSW| Carbon Dynamics | Vorsteiner | Radium Engineering | Hoen

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    That's a pretty nice difference! Obviously larger due to a boosted setup but still shows the SS header quality.

    Its a fairly expensive piece though isn't it?

  3. #3
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    That's a pretty nice difference! Obviously larger due to a boosted setup but still shows the SS header quality.

    Its a fairly expensive piece though isn't it?
    Yes; Supersprint is very proud of their exhaust components. However, so far, the exhaust setup is living up to this. Excellent workmanship and fitment. And, flow. Low level resonance, i.e., drone, is also minimal with this setup.
    Click here to enlarge
    2006 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Carbon Black Metallic | Cinnamon | No Sunroof | OE CSL Bootlid | 3.91 Diff | TCK | DrVanos | Volk
    StopTech ST-40 | Supersprint V1 Stepped | Bimmerworld C&R | BSW| Carbon Dynamics | Vorsteiner | Radium Engineering | Hoen

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    looks pretty damn strong to me

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    Anyone know how I can edit my original post. I have a cleaner looking graph to use.

    Thanks, Norm

    Click here to enlarge
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    2006 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Carbon Black Metallic | Cinnamon | No Sunroof | OE CSL Bootlid | 3.91 Diff | TCK | DrVanos | Volk
    StopTech ST-40 | Supersprint V1 Stepped | Bimmerworld C&R | BSW| Carbon Dynamics | Vorsteiner | Radium Engineering | Hoen

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by normcaldwell Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Yes; Supersprint is very proud of their exhaust components. However, so far, the exhaust setup is living up to this. Excellent workmanship and fitment. And, flow. Low level resonance, i.e., drone, is also minimal with this setup.
    What's the cost though in comparison to others?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by normcaldwell Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Anyone know how I can edit my original post. I have a cleaner looking graph to use.

    Thanks, Norm

    http://www.bimmerboost.com/images/im...tepped_2-1.jpg
    Done.

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    Awesome Norm!

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    Confused, your running ess hardware, and Evolve software?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    your running ess hardware, and Evolve software?
    Happens more often than you think.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Confused, your running ess hardware, and Evolve software?
    I warned ya...

    Now your curiosity will take over. Over under on how long it takes LM to try another tune for his hardware? How about 60 days?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MisterEm Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I warned ya...

    Now your curiosity will take over. Over under on how long it takes LM to try another tune for his hardware? How about 60 days?
    IMO the best setup/combination available for the E92 M3.. At least until Evolve themselves release their own S/C Click here to enlarge

    @normcaldwell Great post! Damn I want to go for a ride in your M3! Click here to enlarge
    09' CTS-V Sedan- Black Raven, Auto, Recaros, Stock for now..

    E60 M5 SMG - Sapphire Black exterior, Black interior,
    Full leather, Ventilated comfort seats, Aluminum trim, Alcantara Headliner, Matte Black front/side grills, 20% window tint, Plasti Dipped Black Wheels, Hardwired 9500ix, RPI scoops(Red), Block off plates, BMC filters (c/f delete), Evolve-R Stage 2 Tune, Muffler & Secondary Cat Delete

    P500s S6 DSC OFF- ALL DAY, EVERY DAY.. Unless it's wet out
    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

  13. #13
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    ugh... killin me smalls.. your killin me..

  14. #14
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Confused, your running ess hardware, and Evolve software?
    Yep. I also have the ESS software, which, of course, comes with the kit.
    I had such a good experience with Evolve when I was running NA, I decided to try them with FI.
    No regrets!


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MisterEm Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I warned ya...
    lol . . . yes you did!


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TZ04XJR Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    IMO the best setup/combination available for the E92 M3.. At least until Evolve themselves release their own S/C Click here to enlarge

    @normcaldwell Great post! Damn I want to go for a ride in your M3! Click here to enlarge
    Thanks! I'm in Denver; where are you?
    In a wallet-saving sort of way, I kind of hope Sal decides to not develop an E46 M3 s/c setup . . . . I'd be tempted out of my mind, ha ha.
    Click here to enlarge
    2006 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Carbon Black Metallic | Cinnamon | No Sunroof | OE CSL Bootlid | 3.91 Diff | TCK | DrVanos | Volk
    StopTech ST-40 | Supersprint V1 Stepped | Bimmerworld C&R | BSW| Carbon Dynamics | Vorsteiner | Radium Engineering | Hoen

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    What's the cost though in comparison to others?
    If you look at new for new, the Supersprint headers/section 1 combo is not much different than OE Euro headers/section 1. To me, those two are a good comparison for fitment and quality of materials/workmanship. So, good point about the comparison question.
    Click here to enlarge
    2006 M3 Coupe | 6MT | Carbon Black Metallic | Cinnamon | No Sunroof | OE CSL Bootlid | 3.91 Diff | TCK | DrVanos | Volk
    StopTech ST-40 | Supersprint V1 Stepped | Bimmerworld C&R | BSW| Carbon Dynamics | Vorsteiner | Radium Engineering | Hoen

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by normcaldwell Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    If you look at new for new, the Supersprint headers/section 1 combo is not much different than OE Euro headers/section 1. To me, those two are a good comparison for fitment and quality of materials/workmanship. So, good point about the comparison question.
    In that case I think the Supersprint becomes a no brainer if looking new.

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    Norm, great post once again!

    I am so glad that you gave the Supersprint V1 Stepped Headers and V1 Cats a chance. It's a hefty investment, but in my opinion, still well worth it. As Sal said before, this graph is a very good indication of how well the longer tube, wider inner diameter, and monstrous collector work! When a lot of other header designs start to taper off at the top end, these Stepped Headers pull non-stop! The best part too is no sacrifice in low end torque.

    Supersprint products are very expensive, but to me, well worth saving for.

    Congrats again! Keep us posted on if @evolve sends you an updated tune to flatten that AFR a bit.

    @MisterEm ... you're next. It'll be cool to see your dyno comparison as well. We have mine versus otherwise stock, Norm's with boost, and now your beast Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    ugh... killin me smalls.. your killin me..
    Click here to enlarge
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
    2009 E90 M3 DCT | Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth

  18. #18
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    I am on it Alex. New baseline should be done next week.

    Here is a new vt2-500 build. Waaaaayy down on power from Norm's. Apparently the folks on e46fan consider a tune that "lacks of cam/VANOS control = conservative."

    http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=958273

    Mike

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by normcaldwell Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

    Thanks! I'm in Denver; where are you?
    In a wallet-saving sort of way, I kind of hope Sal decides to not develop an E46 M3 s/c setup . . . . I'd be tempted out of my mind, ha ha.
    Likewise.. I'm certain one of these days they will begin development for the M60 M5 too. Click here to enlarge I don't blame them for tackling the S65 M3 first.

    I'm down in Texas. However, I make it all over the place for work on a regular basis. If Denver comes on the schedule, I'll certainly reach out and see if you are available to link up. Usually a week in a rental car can get pretty boring. I'm sure a ride in your M3 would make it much more bearable until I cam get back home to my beast Click here to enlarge

    -TZ
    09' CTS-V Sedan- Black Raven, Auto, Recaros, Stock for now..

    E60 M5 SMG - Sapphire Black exterior, Black interior,
    Full leather, Ventilated comfort seats, Aluminum trim, Alcantara Headliner, Matte Black front/side grills, 20% window tint, Plasti Dipped Black Wheels, Hardwired 9500ix, RPI scoops(Red), Block off plates, BMC filters (c/f delete), Evolve-R Stage 2 Tune, Muffler & Secondary Cat Delete

    P500s S6 DSC OFF- ALL DAY, EVERY DAY.. Unless it's wet out
    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

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    @LostMarine

    Compare Norm's graph above to this exact same kit. Car has headers and race cats similar to Norm's as well. Both off the meth and on 91 octane alone. This is the same VT2-500 intercooled kit.

    Look at the ESS versus Evolve E9X N/A tune for example. Ask the people who have had both which they would retain? Click here to enlarge

    I am not doubting ESS's hardware one bit. But their software has been proven WOEFULLY inadequate in both the N/A and F/I'ed S54 world. The lack of VANOS and proper cam control are the supposed culprits. I would imagine this theory remains true with the S65.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MisterEm Click here to enlarge
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Look at the ESS versus Evolve E9X N/A tune for example. Ask the people who have had both which they would retain?
    This car also has a 4.10 diff though.

  22. #22
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    And Norm has a 3.91. The cars and kits are about about as close as you could get.

    The point is the delta is not explainable without discussing tuning capabilities.

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    holy $#@!.. thats pretty damn impressive

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    good review

    how about doing rms headers vs ss v1 headers ?

    i am in the market for a headers but really confused between these two !!!

  25. #25
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
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    holy $#@!.. thats pretty damn impressive
    There is another gentleman with the VT2-500 kit and 4.10 gears (Tchleung on e46fan and m3forum). The car couldn't crack 400 rwhp/275 rwtq with the ESS tune. Check post #22 here: http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=958273

    Now he's at 456rwhp/312tq at the kits lower boost level and an Evolve tune. Quite comparable to Norm's numbers as well.

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