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  1. #1
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    M3 DCT Build Journal - World's First BMW DCT Build

    DISCLAIMER: Gintani and SSP are working on this project together. SSP is doing the manufacturing, engineering, and design as they do for DCT's and Gintani will be handling distribution of parts.

    The time has come to announce the details of my transmission build. No one has attempted this before and there unfortunately are no off the shelf parts. Everything will have to be custom made for this application which means the build time will be around 10 weeks from this point. This thread will be updated periodically with pictures and details every step of the way. I will be providing complete documented details through the process.

    Click here to enlarge


    Why is the transmission being built?

    For one, to handle more power and for longevity. It is no secret I have abused my transmission from the moment I got the car. I have done more launches at the drag strip using launch control than... anyone really. These launches are abusive, generate tremendous heat, and shorten the lifespan. Once supercharged, the issue was exacerbated. At a single event in '09 I used launch control 19 times with a burnout each time which generates considerable heat. I have attended 5 such events. Additionally, I have done launches on the street. I would estimate a conservative 70-80 uses of launch control up to this point.

    So the transmission is weak?

    No, not at all. Actually, it took far more than anyone would have thought. At these drag events, I would also run back to back at times. Keep in mind, I bumped the launch control RPM up as high as it would go, 6200 RPM. These are 6200 RPM launches after a burnout again and again. I estimate 70-80 uses and a properly used manual clutch in comparison should be good for about 50 passes before needing to be replaced. Just to give an idea of the abuse I put it through, I needed new motor mounts a year in as the abuse in the launches took its toll. Oops Click here to enlarge

    Heat also contributed to shortening the lifespan. The moment I got the supercharger completed the car was on its way to the strip, literally. No exaggeration here, supercharger was completed and the car was on its way to the Famoso drag strip. It arrived with 15 minutes to spare and no cooldown whatsoever. I'm the kind of person that didn't want to save it for another day and decided to go for it. A mistake in retrospect as after the burnout I attempted to use launch control and it overheated. There are two levels of overheats, one that shows a yellow cog on the Idrive screen and one that shows a red cog. I got the red cog which means limp mode and no power until the transmission drops back down to temp. Instead of cooling it down, I decided to try again since now only 10 minutes were left. Launch control would not engage so I just mashed the gas and this worked. No overheat, full pass, no problem, however some timer light malfunction prevented a readout. I had a chance for one last pass back to back after this and I went for it. Tried launch control, it engaged, and on the first to second shift it overheated, red cog again, event over, no clean pass and a transmission lifespan shortened.

    The best bet for launching the DCT at the strip or on the street for that matter with longevity in mind is to not use launch control. I learned this the hard way. However, the best bet for best times IS to use launch control.

    How much power can the DCT take?

    The unit BMW uses for the M3 is the Getrag 7DCI600. They rate it up to 440 pound-feet and 9000 RPM which is actually even a bit conservative. My transmission took about this torque level without incident driving around. It is the launches and overheats which made it so the clutch packs started slipping. It never fully gave out just the clutch packs were starting to slip and it was not going to get any better especially as I strove to add more power. If launches and drag strip visits are removed from the equation, on the street with a supercharger, absolutely no issues, just like stock. One can even exceed the recommended 440 pound-foot limit if just using it on the street like a normal person. Here is an up close shot of my transmission:

    Click here to enlarge

    Ferrari's unit for the California, the Getrag 7DCL750, is rated for up to 553 pound-feet. It is also a much larger transmission and weighs 264 pounds compared to the M3's 7DCI600's 173 pounds. The Nissan GTR's GR6 by Borg Warner in comparison is rated for up to 650 pound-feet. It also has 6 speeds vs. the Getrag units 7.

    So, you abused your transmission, the clutch packs started to slip, what were you going to do?

    Well, I decided to build it. I knew I was not about to stop adding power any time soon so this would have to be done sooner or later. I also knew I wanted to use launch control on the strip. I started contacting companies building transmissions for the Nissan GTR seeing if any would be capable of tackling the M3 DCT. If you can name a company, I contacted them. I tried anyone and everyone and only one company said they could do it and were excited about the challenge of doing it. That company is South Side Performance: http://www.sspperformance.com/

    Click here to enlarge

    SSP is currently the premier Aftermarket Dual Clutch Transmission Specialist in the world. They have been doing work on the GR6 in the GTR as well as the EVO SST's. They were the only company with the capability to tackle this project. Everyone else said it was not worth it, too small of a market, or that they did not have the capability to do it. Kris @ SSP told me to bring it on and that he would do what was necessary to get this thing to perform the way I wanted it to on the drag strip where performance is proven. I like that attitude Click here to enlarge

    So what has SSP done? Well, SSP builds dual clutch transmissions that can do this:



    Additionally, they are pushing the boundaries of what a DCT can take such as with their 1000 pound-foot GR6 clutch:

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Kris@SSP
    SSP is working on a new 14 DISC clutch set up that will be capable of 1000 foot pounds of torque. Fourteen clutch discs allows for more clutch surface area. More surface area means more power to the ground, and less chance of clutch slippage during launching. SSP's new clutch assembly will also utilize the latest in high temp VITON seal technology. While the factory GR6 clutch basket is capable of supporting such incredible horsepower, the factory seals are not. SSP has developed a complete set of high temp Viton seals for the GR6 clutch basket.
    Click here to enlarge

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    They are not limited to the GTR world but also build EVO SST's that handle over 500 whp:

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    Additionally, they also do Audi DSG upgrades and now will be providing upgrades for the BMW M3 DCT before anyone else.

    I would also like to address this comment made by a so called "industry insider" who I will not directly name. Let's just call him Lemans_Cleveland:

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Lemans_Cleveland
    And NO, the DCT transmission cannot be repaired in the field.

    Replacement is your only option, and that takes place at Getrag's factory repair facility in Neuenstein, Germany. (the only authorized DCT repair facility in the world)
    Seems SSP and I are proving you wrong as replacement is not your only option and not only can the DCT be repaired outside of Germany, it can be strengthened.

    Here are the pictures of my transmisison upon arrival today at SSP.

    This is the flywheel, and the interesting thing is, the transmission counts the teeth on the back of the flywheel. No other DCT SSP has seen does this and it seems the purpose would be to detect wheelspin:

    Click here to enlarge

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    Here is the transmission itself:

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    The bellhousing:

    Click here to enlarge

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    This is the beginning of what should a very interesting process. SSP will be going into the internals this weekend and we will see exactly what is going on inside and what I have done to it Click here to enlarge We will also learn how much room there is for improvement and how much potential torque we can make this thing take! Keep checking back to follow the updates or check on twitter: http://twitter.com/bimmerboost

  2. #2
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    I would also like to welcome Kris from SSP to the site!

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    excited to see this happening! good move sticky!
    Current:
    13 E92 M3 ZCP
    - WSIR 1:33:9 / BW C13 2:03:5 / ACS 1:56:7
    (Stock besides wheels/tires - Rs3)
    WSIR 1:32:8 / BW C13 1:59:2 / ACS 1:55:1
    (KW ClubSport 3 way / Rs3)
    WSIR 1:30:9 / BW C13 1:57:7
    (above plus Apr Wing)

  4. #4
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    damn. $#@! got real!!!

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    Look forward to seeing what you did to the poor thing and what SSP does with their magic!

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    Looking forward to this thread. Keep it coming!

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    Epic I'd say.

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    Wow your thread on M3Post is gone already... That was fast. Guess well all have to follow it here! LOL

    D

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    Great stuff!Click here to enlarge

    Paving the way for the quickest DCT M3 times.Click here to enlarge

  10. #10
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Definitive Click here to enlarge
    Wow your thread on M3Post is gone already... That was fast. Guess well all have to follow it here! LOL
    Didn't make it.. wonder who did though? Would ask for a link... but well, little late for that. Click here to enlarge

    I'm sure the word will get around even without Jason's blessing.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Didn't make it.. wonder who did though? Would ask for a link... but well, little late for that. Click here to enlarge

    I'm sure the word will get around even without Jason's blessing.


    It is posted again by another member.

    Thread has now been edited of all bimmerboost references. They even edited my post, I told the guy this will be deleted.

  12. #12
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge

    It is posted again by another member.

    Thread has now been edited of all bimmerboost references. They even edited my post, I told the guy this will be deleted.
    Probably will be, whatever.

    They can't control the internet, enough people view this site now that there is nothing they can do about it and they should get comfortable with that.

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    Will you be able to do any software upgrades with the new tranny, one of the problems i found was that the software was tuned for the original hp and when you added some more hp the clutsches started to slip and started to overheat, i believe the clutches need a new software that make them grip harder and faster.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pea Click here to enlarge
    Will you be able to do any software upgrades with the new tranny, one of the problems i found was that the software was tuned for the original hp and when you added some more hp the clutsches started to slip and started to overheat, i believe the clutches need a new software that make them grip harder and faster.
    You have been reading too much of someone's marketing!

    Software can't change mechanical limitations. Software won't make the clutches grip any harder nor cool the DCT any better. There has been no demonstration to this point to substantiate anyone has been able to get the DCT to shift faster when it already shifts at .004 of a second. The company claiming they are able to make it shift faster has slower DCT 60-130 times than the company who has not changed these parameters. I also have yet to see anyone demonstrate control of the DCT in the sense of adjusting launch control RPM out of the BMW provided window.

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    Well i actually got the info from another source, my brother in law are technical manager at Volvo, and are currently working on there new DCT tranny.
    He is responsible for the development of both hardware and software.
    He actually tested my stage 3 335 dct ,and told me that the soft ware had to be reprogrammed because of the increased hp.
    He told me that they had different DCT software for different motors,just to get rid of clutch slippering or hard shifts.

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    I saw your car at Gintani last night... that thing is going to be one sick ass car when its done

  17. #17
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pea Click here to enlarge
    Well i actually got the info from another source, my brother in law are technical manager at Volvo, and are currently working on there new DCT tranny.
    He is responsible for the development of both hardware and software.
    He actually tested my stage 3 335 dct ,and told me that the soft ware had to be reprogrammed because of the increased hp.
    He told me that they had different DCT software for different motors,just to get rid of clutch slippering or hard shifts.
    The software has to be changed for more hp but not the software that is governing shifts or any type of clutch engagement. The idea is to raise the torque limits that the ecu is sensitive to.

    Clutch slipping is not going to be because of software, but hardware.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The software has to be changed for more hp but not the software that is governing shifts or any type of clutch engagement. The idea is to raise the torque limits that the ecu is sensitive to.

    Clutch slipping is not going to be because of software, but hardware.
    well i am not convinced but i hope you are right, when i Change the powerband in my 335 i get more torque at low rpms, when i do a kick down at low rpms it feels like the clutch starts to slipper, i actually did get some limpmodes because of overheated tranny.
    But there is a big difference if you shift manual or auto.

  19. #19
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pea Click here to enlarge
    well i am not convinced but i hope you are right, when i Change the powerband in my 335 i get more torque at low rpms, when i do a kick down at low rpms it feels like the clutch starts to slipper, i actually did get some limpmodes because of overheated tranny.
    But there is a big difference if you shift manual or auto.
    I'm sure it probably does slip. However, all software can do is cut the power not remedy the limitation of the stock clutch packs that your torque level has exceeded.

    No doubt on your overheated tranny issues as well, I have had my fair share.

    Basically, software and hardware combine to raise the torque limits and such but software won't increase cooling capacity or clutch disc surface area.

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    Are we talking about the same software , the one i am talking about is controlling how hard the clutsches are going to grip,and if they donīt grip hard enough= slippering clutsch=overheting.
    You have to excuse me but i donīt use this language that often.

  21. #21
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pea Click here to enlarge
    Are we talking about the same software , the one i am talking about is controlling how hard the clutsches are going to grip,and if they donīt grip hard enough= slippering clutsch=overheting.
    You have to excuse me but i donīt use this language that often.
    That's fine man, no worries, but how hard the clutches grip is a physical limitation. The software can control when they engage, but not the torque level they can handle.

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    Someone reposted this thread on fagpost. Considering their $#@!ry you should tell them to take it down. Why should their site get traffic relating to your project?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fstop7 Click here to enlarge
    Someone reposted this thread on fagpost. Considering their $#@!ry you should tell them to take it down. Why should their site get traffic relating to your project?
    It is a bit more than that. Actually, the person who posted it linked to the images here with the watermark, no problem. I'm happy to share.

    The bimmerpost admin actually edited my photos to remove my watermark to not give me credit. A bit sad they are that scared of me and go to such lengths, as if the total censorship of bimmerboost.com links wasn't enough. I mean, this thing is being built with the details posted for everyone, I at least deserve credit as the source. No big deal, if that is how they want to behave it makes them look bad, not me. People are going to talk about it anyway and everyone knows they censor everything. They won't get away with it for too much longer.

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    Thats awesome that SSP are taking this on! Cant wait to see the results!
    Click here to enlarge



    EURO 04 M3 Current Mods:GC DAs, Eibach Sways, PF RTAB's, RE RCAs, INTRAVEE II, Black Roundels, ///MFEST Badges, Depo's, Screen protector for NAV display, VCSL Bumper + Race Lip & CF Trunk & CF Rear Diffusor, DIETZ TV in Motion, SS= V1 Headers + catless pipes + X-Pipe + SS Sport Exhaust, Z8 Starter Button, Lamin-X, OEM CSL interior, OEM CSL Steering, OEM CSL Intake, OEM CSL Roof, MSS54HP + OEM CSL Tune, BBS CH's, LIGHTWERKZ, 355mm ST40 BBK, BW Oil Cooler....

  25. #25
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Monster135 Click here to enlarge
    I saw your car at Gintani last night... that thing is going to be one sick ass car when its done
    Thanks man, I hope so Click here to enlarge

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