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  1. #1
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    93 Octane vs Unleaded Race Gas / E85

    Trying this in a separate thread to get more attention.

    For those who have tuned a vehicle with the same boost parameters (if FI), or NA and changed only octane, how much more timing were you able to add, and as a result, how much power were you able to pick up?

    This is focused on the M54, but S54 information welcome.
    Thanks.

    -Matt

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    On 93 octane my Stock Turbo, FBO N54 is tapped out at 420 WHP / 480 WTQ. Running straight E85 (from a pump) and only making changes to fueling & adding timing (because boost is already maxed out) increases power to 460 WHP / 500 WTQ, a 40 WHP & 20 WTQ gain by just changing fueling.

    You can Google for other results on different platforms to see average gains from 93 -> 100 Octane+ or E85, but it will vary depending on the build specifics (N/A vs. Supercharged vs. Turbo). The most important thing when running E85 is that you have a fueling system that at a minimum will be able to support a 30% increase in demand.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

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    91 Octane - 620rwhp
    80% Ethanol - 800 rwhp with alot more room

    no comparison...compare it to C16

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    Performance wise, it's def a better comparison E85 vs. C16 (leaded). The problem is the significant price difference, and that you can actually buy E98 or FTW E85 which will still yield additional power. But like I said, you're gonna need a modified fuel system that's operating around 50% on pump gas.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    On 93 octane my Stock Turbo, FBO N54 is tapped out at 420 WHP / 480 WTQ. Running straight E85 (from a pump) and only making changes to fueling & adding timing (because boost is already maxed out) increases power to 460 WHP / 500 WTQ, a 40 WHP & 20 WTQ gain by just changing fueling.

    You can Google for other results on different platforms to see average gains from 93 -> 100 Octane+ or E85, but it will vary depending on the build specifics (N/A vs. Supercharged vs. Turbo). The most important thing when running E85 is that you have a fueling system that at a minimum will be able to support a 30% increase in demand.
    What was your baseline on the dyno used with these numbers?

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    Hmm.

    So what I read so far is that it will give me a much larger safety headroom vs pure 93, but I may quickly hit limits in other parts of the drivetrain that will negate the usefulness of it, at a fairly quick rate. I need information in my other thread about the stock clutch capability first to determine if this is a path I want to go down.

    It is nice to see that you can pick up a good amount of power with timing changes alone.

    I appreciate everyone's input so far.

    -Matt

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    On 93 octane my Stock Turbo, FBO N54 is tapped out at 420 WHP / 480 WTQ. Running straight E85 (from a pump) and only making changes to fueling & adding timing (because boost is already maxed out) increases power to 460 WHP / 500 WTQ, a 40 WHP & 20 WTQ gain by just changing fueling.

    You can Google for other results on different platforms to see average gains from 93 -> 100 Octane+ or E85, but it will vary depending on the build specifics (N/A vs. Supercharged vs. Turbo). The most important thing when running E85 is that you have a fueling system that at a minimum will be able to support a 30% increase in demand.
    Sure thing brother.... except my friend had a tough timing dyno'ing 425 on E85.
    2007 335i (100% stock with mods)

    N54 is not a German 2JZ lol

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    Sure thing brother.... except my friend had a tough timing dyno'ing 425 on E85.
    As far as i'm aware I haven't seen those numbers on pump with RB's (or rarely). Bren just reads way high IMO.

  9. #9
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    Sure thing brother.... except my friend had a tough timing dyno'ing 425 on E85.
    What's your stock baseline

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    As far as i'm aware I haven't seen those numbers on pump with RB's (or rarely). Bren just reads way high IMO.
    Funny, cause nobody called bull$#@! when I pulled off 430 WHP / 460 WTQ on a light E85 blend (still utilizing the OEM LPFP). Bren was able to squeeze an additional 40 WHP from a car that had been previously tuned on the street in 95*+ and humid weather. Ask @bobS , who was also recently can confirm that Bren's tunes are the real deal. 400 WHP+ isn't a big deal on 93, the PTF guys could just as easily do it.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  10. #10
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    What was your baseline on the dyno used with these numbers?
    On Bren's dyno I baselined 285 WHP / 280 WTQ with Full Bolt-Ons. So the deltas are there.

    Same with the RBs, if you're not mid-upper 400s on Pump & Over 500 WHP with E85 (especially now that there are Low & High Pressure Fueling Upgrades), there's something wrong with your tune.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  11. #11
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    I'll have to get the numbers together for what bren did on my car but I don't think it reads high, look at his dyno database online. His personal 335 has the same software version as mine so I'm running his tune, with vanos, air / fuel etc...that he modified and it's smooth and really powerful. I haven't posted anything bc Brendan was going to throw my dynos on his website... I am beyond happy with this pro tune and I've run every tune out there except Dinan.
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    ESS 6XX kit

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