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    335d diesel intercooler options - CX-racing universal

    Hey guys,

    Sorry for the slow response. The intercooler is a CX-racing universal intercooler for a 335i. I paid $169 shipped to my door for it but it required welding mounting tabs to make it fit. PITA!!

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/CXRacing-Tur...56fe77&vxp=mtr

    I suggest you buy this kit. you will still have work to do but MUCH less.
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/CXRACING-201...0fb47d&vxp=mtr

    I will post later on how to do the piping with Pics and parts to order.

    -Ed

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    Moved to its own thread, good stuff.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
    : http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    Do at your own risk!!!!!
    Ok, so this CX-Racing Kit i mentioned in may last post does not have the correct Piping configuration, but i'll help try and guide you through it. If you have any concerns on the quality of the intercooler, i have custom made some in the past with Bell cores and they look almost exact matches. Bell is up in the top as far as intercooler cores available.

    1. When you get the kit, I would imagine you should just follow the instructions to install the intercooler on the car. You're going to forget about the piping it comes with unless one piece matches what I'm about to give you below.

    Get an air saw for this job!! You will have to cut some of the plastic for the intercooler to fit; use the picture above as an example.

    2. Pull the red hose off of the turbo. To remove this hose off of the turbo, push the black locking clip up and then pull it off. Pull the locking ring off of the connector and then gently slide the hose off.
    Good thread to read http://www.bavarian-board.co.uk/foru...ne-replacement
    3. Pull the charge pipe out that goes to the throttle body. Pull the clip off of the connector on the throttle body. Gentely pull the hose assembly out through the top and then unplug the sensor.
    4. Now that we have both hoses in hand, we have to cut off the two connectors that went to the intercooler.
    With a cut off wheel cut all the way around the two intercooler connectors like this. Don't cut the hose!!!
    Click here to enlarge
    You will have a 2.25" ID hose end on each when you're done.
    Click here to enlarge
    5.Gently clean the inside and seal of the connector that goes on the turbo. Take some lithium grease or oil and coat the seal and inside of the connector.
    Click here to enlarge
    6. Clean the end of the turbo with a rag and install the hose back on the turbo.
    Click here to enlarge
    7. You will need two 2.5" to 2.25" silicone reducer 45deg elbows and two 2.25" aluminum elbows.
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-25-ALUMINU...1fc062&vxp=mtr
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-25-to-2-5-...844093&vxp=mtr
    8. You will put the silicone elbow on the intercooler angled out towards the side of the car.
    9. Take your time and use the aluminum elbows to connect between the intercooler, turbo and throttlebody. Cut little bits at a time off of the pipes as you trial fit, you can turn the silicone hoses a little to make things fit better. you will need someone to weld a bead on the end of the pipes ot roll a lip so they can't slide out under pressure. I will post my final pipe sizes and pics later.
    until next week................

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    ^ Great stuff

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
    : http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    I'll add these pics to this thread too.

    Click here to enlarge

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    How does the car run now? Big improvement? Tell us more! Click here to enlarge

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    To be honest, I have not had a chance to push it because Im waiting on the Aluminum pipes to arrive this coming Tuesday. I have temporary "PVC" piping that is getting me back and forth to work but Im sure they would blow off if I pushed the car hard.

    I personally do not like many of the aftermarket intercoolers that are made deeper and fit in the same location as the stock one. The stock core is 4.5 thick and some of these aftermarket units are up to 6. If you read up on intercooler efficiency you hear that the main qualities of a good intercooler are efficiency, flow and recovery. Efficiency is how well the intercooler can cool the compressed air; flow is how much air you can push though the intercooler and not get a pressure drop from one side to the other; that is not good. Recovery is how quickly the intercooler can cool back down to ambient temperature.

    As most things in life, too much of one thing is not good. Too much cooling ability can restrict flow. Too much flow can reduce your cooling ability. Usually, recovery is dependent on surface area facing incoming ambient air to the core and the cores efficiency (ability to disperse heat).

    The reason I like the CX-racing is the core is 12 tall versus the 5 tall stock core; core length are about the same. The CX unit is only 3.5 thick/deep allowing air to pass through it with less restriction. The increased surface area provides more even cooling capacity. A short deep core does not do as well because the air passing through the core gets hotter as it goes from front to back and restricts the air flow past the point of being efficient for a non-track car that is not running at high speeds during operation all the time. Most of our cars are for in town stop and go or short burst driving. You want as much of the intercooler to get fresh cool air with less restricted flow through the core.

    The next best option for me was the Helix step core intercooler for the 335i. It may be a bolt in setup that may even fit the stock hose setup on our cars. What they do is increase the depth of the core like other companies but they also increase the frontal surface area with their step design. The only down side for me was the price $800 in a group buy $1100 normally and the fact that it is HEAVY!!!! For a total cost of $200 and some work on my part, I feel I got a better overall solution.

    What I do plan to do is provide CX-Racing with the parts and dimensions so that they may be able to produce complete kits for the diesel at the same $550 shipped price. If you are a DIYer and can weld tabs and such, Im sure they would offer just the piping kit with the lip beads ready to go. I would imagine that kit being about $250 or so.

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    So are you the first person to upgrade the FMIC on the diesel? I would really like to see what kind of gains you get, dyno please!
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    Click here to enlarge

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    @TurboEddie great job, FINALLY some one with COJONES, I've been looking for soemeone to mod their car and you come around, I have the RENNtech flash I imagine with this setup like LENNY from RENNtech told me would unleash even more the BEAST I have on hand. Amigo BTW like DBFIU stated did you do the dyno before and try the dyno after to see if any gains come thru. Gracias for your insight

    BTW the price would beat the competiton by a MILE!!!!
    Last edited by Puerto Rican 335d; 05-04-2012 at 09:45 AM. Reason: Add more info

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    Because RENNtech is here in Florida, I plan to let them seewhat they can safely get out of it with an intercooler.

    As far as gains from just the intercooler I would assume youwould gain a little power and torque with no flash because cooler air makes more power always. Out of observation driving back and forth to work i notice mygauge showed better MPG in the morning when it was cooler even in stock form.Now with the new intercooler both readings have shifted to the left showing better fuel economy. I would hover around the 40mpg mark on the highway before and now it is hovering between 45-50mpg. This is from simple observation of the gauge though. I do consistently get over 530 miles to one tank and I would imagine once i get more miles on the motor that number will get closer to 600.

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    Ed, thank you for the in depth explanation of your thought process, it makes a lot of sense.

    It sounds like you're familiar with the status quo of fmic's when it comes to the 335i: the conventional wisdom is to use the deeper, shorter i/c designs, just like you mentioned. The reasons given by the suppliers are that 1) the fmic will fit in the factory location with no or minimal cutting, 2) the lower profile fmic does not obstruct the radiator at all (like the taller designs do), and 3) the taller fmic is obstructed from clean air flow at the top by the bumper or whatever physical obstruction is sitting there.

    I will admit that those reasons make sense to me, particularly the radiator concern, since BMW saw fit to give our cars a second smaller radiator, I assume they were concerned about cooling.

    Those of us in the d world have been sitting on the sideline since there aren't very many d's, and consequently the suppliers have a hard time justifying putting any development into our cars. We don't even know if the 335i options fit our cars, since none of the suppliers have test fitted them. So - your effort and work is an extremely positive development, since you are just about a party of one for the d!

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    Ditto @62Lincoln we hope this is resolved soon, @TurboEddie excellent job and BTW talk to LENNY @RENNtech, tell him Axel From Puerto Rico is closely looking at his link. I am pretty sure Hartmut Feyhl owner of RENNtech would like to see this go thru

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    i would bet your MPGs are going up also due to the reduction in EGTs with a larger front mount. Diesels seem to run better and get better mpgs when they arent sucking in 200 degree air....which is pretty typical considering they run higher boost than a 335 would (im assuming you guys are up in the 20+psi range?)

    My diesel tow rig works the same way...a 4 row Cummins intercooler off a box truck dropped my exhaust gas temps by 200 degrees alone...and I still have a super restrictive exhaust manifold.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Matt@AUTOCouture Click here to enlarge
    i would bet your MPGs are going up also due to the reduction in EGTs with a larger front mount. Diesels seem to run better and get better mpgs when they arent sucking in 200 degree air....which is pretty typical considering they run higher boost than a 335 would (im assuming you guys are up in the 20+psi range?)
    Matt, the BMW literature quotes the d's boost pressure at 28 psi, so you're right on the money. One of the questions I've pondered is whether or not the d requires a somewhat different i/c because of the boost. On realoem, the illustrations for the 335i and 335d appear the same, yet the part numbers are different. That suggests something is different, but no one knows for sure. I'm certainly not knowledgeable enough to know! Click here to enlarge

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    There are a few People in Europe and maybe here in the USthat have already adapted these 335i intercoolers on their cars, so it’s been done before.
    These cars run 26.5 PSI stock from what I've read.

    As far as the intercooler in front of the radiator, it's not that big of a deal because the intercooler is not that thick and the air coming out of the backside is still cooler than the radiation by a LOT. On my car, the air can also come from the top inlets and go down behind the intercooler to cool the radiator. Remember, the forced air coming in the bumper will create a high pressure zone and move to a lower pressure zone (between the intercooler andA/C condenser) and try to equal out. You also have cooler air entering the engine that also helps keep the engine temperature from wanting to climb as fast.

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    My buddy is upgrading his 335i soon so i'll be able to do a one to one comparison between the two.

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    Ed, glad you're on our side in this! Click here to enlarge

    I went and dug up the psi info, so we'll at least know for sure. From a BMW document titled "9th Diesel Engine Emission Reduction Conference, Newport, Rhode Island, 24. – 28. August 2003" on page 4 we have this: "Maximum boost pressure increases from 2,1 to 2,3 bar and the new turbocharger has a improved efficiency."

    Bar to psi conversion is bar/.07, so 2.1 bar is 30 psi and 2.3 bar is 32.9 psi. Holy crap! More than I remembered!

    There might be more current info floating around out there, but this document was the only BMW originated one that I have that mentioned boost pressure.

    I hope you can work with CX-Racing on the parts. As others have mentioned, their prices will blow the existing products out of the water!

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 62Lincoln Click here to enlarge
    Matt, the BMW literature quotes the d's boost pressure at 28 psi, so you're right on the money. One of the questions I've pondered is whether or not the d requires a somewhat different i/c because of the boost. On realoem, the illustrations for the 335i and 335d appear the same, yet the part numbers are different. That suggests something is different, but no one knows for sure. I'm certainly not knowledgeable enough to know! Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 62Lincoln Click here to enlarge
    Ed, glad you're on our side in this! Click here to enlarge

    I went and dug up the psi info, so we'll at least know for sure. From a BMW document titled "9th Diesel Engine Emission Reduction Conference, Newport, Rhode Island, 24. – 28. August 2003" on page 4 we have this: "Maximum boost pressure increases from 2,1 to 2,3 bar and the new turbocharger has a improved efficiency."

    Bar to psi conversion is bar/.07, so 2.1 bar is 30 psi and 2.3 bar is 32.9 psi. Holy crap! More than I remembered!

    There might be more current info floating around out there, but this document was the only BMW originated one that I have that mentioned boost pressure.

    I hope you can work with CX-Racing on the parts. As others have mentioned, their prices will blow the existing products out of the water!
    The OEM 335 intercooler will suck balls, considering we manage to heatsoak it at 14psi on a hot day. I dont think the end tanks are rated to 30psi either.

    The part diagram pics are sometimes the same, but if its a different part number it will indeed be different.

    A really big gain in this car should result in the removal of the DPF, but that will take some significant reverse engineering. Us Dodge guys notice benefits immediatley after removing them....EGTs go way down, Power goes up, idle quality and crusing goes up, and MPGs shoot up now thaf there is no regeneration process anymore.

    There is a pesky CEL which can be erased with a programmer but with BMWs, as always its a bit more involved.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Matt@AUTOCouture Click here to enlarge
    The OEM 335 intercooler will suck balls, considering we manage to heatsoak it at 14psi on a hot day. I dont think the end tanks are rated to 30psi either.
    Gotcha. I only meant that if the 335i oem i/c were the same as the 335d oem i/c, that would mean that all the 335i aftermarket options for fmic replacement would be open to us. Click here to enlarge

    Are the endtanks the one area where the higher boost of the d might affect the design?

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    Based on my stack boost gauge, my X5 35d runs about 28-30PSI peak. Hard to read when going WOT. ; ) Will report back when I've done some proper logging.

    Cool thread!

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 62Lincoln Click here to enlarge
    Gotcha. I only meant that if the 335i oem i/c were the same as the 335d oem i/c, that would mean that all the 335i aftermarket options for fmic replacement would be open to us. Click here to enlarge

    Are the endtanks the one area where the higher boost of the d might affect the design?
    it could very well. @DBFIU has a good thread on here somewhere on intercooler designs and the effects of it..

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Matt@AUTOCouture Click here to enlarge
    it could very well. @DBFIU has a good thread on here somewhere on intercooler designs and the effects of it..
    Found it: http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...ht=intercooler

    Wonder if we could get him involved in this discussion? Does anyone know him well enough to ask?

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    Edit: DBFIU is already in the thread!

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    Hey sorry it took a while.

    You are correct that the higher boost pressure will have an even greater sensitivity to FMIC design and flow philosophy. I think that if BMW used practically the same 335i intercooler for the 335d then you will see even bigger gains on a d then on just a 335i. FMIC performance is directly affected by boost pressure, at low boost pressure, the pressure drop is minimal and any huge advancements in intercooler desng will pick up minimal improvement. At high boost pressure, small changes in diffusion characteristics and flow geometry will have a bigger impact on FMIC performance. I think for the diesel crowd this subject is even more important, you guys run 30 psi boost.

    That being said, almost any aftermarket intercooler compared to an already poorly designed 335i intercooler made for 8 psi, will be a huge improvement over stock. An optimal design, will have smooth flow transitions from endtank through the core and so on and so forth. For the sake of bang for the buck, at this much boost pressure, anything will make a huge difference.
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    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DBFIU Click here to enlarge
    Hey sorry it took a while.

    You are correct that the higher boost pressure will have an even greater sensitivity to FMIC design and flow philosophy. I think that if BMW used practically the same 335i intercooler for the 335d then you will see even bigger gains on a d then on just a 335i. FMIC performance is directly affected by boost pressure, at low boost pressure, the pressure drop is minimal and any huge advancements in intercooler desng will pick up minimal improvement. At high boost pressure, small changes in diffusion characteristics and flow geometry will have a bigger impact on FMIC performance. I think for the diesel crowd this subject is even more important, you guys run 30 psi boost.

    That being said, almost any aftermarket intercooler compared to an already poorly designed 335i intercooler made for 8 psi, will be a huge improvement over stock. An optimal design, will have smooth flow transitions from endtank through the core and so on and so forth. For the sake of bang for the buck, at this much boost pressure, anything will make a huge difference.
    Thank you for adding to the thread. I sent you a pm before I realized you had posted. Would you take a look at my message, and see if you have any more info to add?

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